Where did the name Z-man come from? was it just a quick name Russ, or Roger came up with?John La Zar €“Well, That€™s the hormonal thing, sort off the cross dresser the sex change X chromosome, Y chromosome, and I'm the Z chromosome. I had to ask myself what we're doing, I said, What the hell is this Z-man gag here? And thats how it was explained to me. Pre-DNA.The fact that the film is finally coming out on DVD, does it surprise you? Are you satisfied or shocked? Or ?J.L. - No, no I'm not, I knew it would get its due; actually it came out on laser disc in the early 90€™s but with no extras. It's getting a lot of buzz, it really is, the DVD. It's really well produced € we€™re proud of it. I had a ball doing it, I do the introduction, which was an honor also. I've been told that I look into the camera and I morphed right back into Z-man.- (Laughs)J.L. The driver I think that day wanted to take me to Toscadero State Mental Institution. I told him I'd give up studying method forever, and he just let me go home. (laughs)- The bonus disc of material is great!J.L.- The extras seem pretty wild, Fox of course produced it. We did it in Burbank, it was just great doing it! A two and a half hour interview for all of us, and then I guess they edit it, I was asked to introduce it, and then there's a commentary track € it's great that you can punch in all these different things in, and find all the goodies in it € Dolly Reed, Erica Gavin, Cynthia Myers, Harrison page and myself, we€™re sitting around watching and commenting on the movie, the performances and everything, so that€™s in it too. I really loved doing it, and I loved working with all my colleges, it was interesting being that we're all alive and kicking, and kicking some ass hopefully! It's a double box set, it has a picture gallery and I'm proud of it.Here's one thing I've always wondered € How did you happen to get that part?J. L. - Okay, this is wild € I'm in Hawaii in 1968 doing a classical legit play, and Fox was scouting for the WWII movie Tora Tora Tora about Pearl Harbor, and one of the wonderful guy's gone now, Phil Benjamin was one of the big casting agents at Fox, and some people over at Hawaii Five-o€? I never did Hawaii Five-O,I did a reading while I was doing the play and didn't work for them, but they mentioned that there was this hot young actor on the stage. So, he caught my act, came backstage, introduced himself, and like the callow idiot that I still am, I thought it was a joke , I thought my director had pulled a fast one, right? I€™m in Honolulu, what, Fox is gonna € you know? But he finally convinced me thank God, and one thing led to another. So, I get an audition at Fox for this, I walk in, and there€™s Russ Meyer. He takes one look at me and it was sort of like the Cary Grant with Mae West € €œIf this kid can speak, he€™s got the part!€? I guess he liked the look € So, he gives me the line € €œThe vorpal blade goes snicker snack€? Remember that line, before I cut Blodgette€™s head off?- Yes.J.L. So, I didn€™t know what the hell it was about, nobody€™s explaining, so, I just went into a classical technique thing. So, basically he gave it to me right there. But, we all had to get screen tested Mr. Dick Zanuck . And so, on my screen test € which they€™ve lost, they have the other people€™s screen tests, we all had it the same day, but, the scene was (laughing) €œThe vorpal blade goes snicker snack!€? So, that€™s in essence how I got the part. Hey, I owe it all to Hawaii Five-O.- That€™s something you wouldn€™t expect to just fall in your lap while over in Hawaii.J.L. Well, it just happened to me € because I was doing Camus, Albert Camus € not Guccione€™s €œCaligula€? which is like the French Hamlet € really heavy, ballsed out classical thing, and you know € if I€™d been doing €œThe Boyfriend€™ They probably wouldn€™t have cared, they wouldn€™t have even come over. But I guess it was a combination of € I was at the right age, and had the right training. My formative training was at the prestigious American Conservatory Theater. You know that Theater, on Geary St.- Yes, I do.J.L. That was the sister company of Lawrence Olivier€™s National Rep. That€™s where I got a lot of my training, and my classical chops. I€™m a native of San Francisco, I€™m a homeboy.
I€™m born and raised in San Francisco. Went to a parochial school on Nob hill, my father was a big time gambler in the tenderloin, so, my line is € I was raised by Bishops and bookies, literally € I€™m not kidding. I was raised in the Richmond district where we€™ll be appearing at the Bridge Theater July 7th and 8th. I really hung out as a teenager and into my twenties basically in North Beach at Vesuvio, City Lights, the whole thing. As a kid €underage € about thirteen, fourteen € we€™d sneak into the Hungry I and we€™d catch early Bill Cosby, Theodore Bikel, and all that. Banducci would catch us, throw us out, the next weekend we€™d sneak in somehow, Enrico would catch us, throw us out, got to be a game. (laughs)- You€™d think he€™d let you stay after a while.J.L. Well, we€™re underage, there was enough trouble down there anyway, that was also the Lenny Bruce days, Carol Doda and all that € so, that€™s how I was raised. And people wonder why I did €œBeyond The Valley Of The Dolls€?. (laughs) I didn€™t realize I was doing research.- It seemed pretty natural I guess, just like old times.J.L. Yeah. I loved it € actually; I€™ve said this before € I didn€™t know until even recently that my part was very loosely based supposedly, allegedly on Phil Spector. And, as far as I know € yeah, but nobody ever told me. Now, I€™m not kidding you € I€™ll tell you how I approached this € as a whacked out Richard the third. I played him more like Richard the third, because nobody told me about Spector. Now, about the Z-man thing € I had to ask, and that was a chromosome head, okay fine that makes sense, So I have to wear tits in this anyway, alright fine.- (laughs) Your character I€™ve always thought must€™ve been loosely based on him, I mean, he€™s the only one that could ever be referred to as the teen tycoon of rock I wonder if he's seen it.J.L. You know, just assuming € okay? It€™s not ego, but he must€™ve seen the movie, because, you know € the rock world really loved that movie, they embraced it immediately, they got it € they got the satire.- At that time, the movie world treated the actors of this film differently than most others, why was that?J.L. Because they were partly embarrassed € first of all, we didn€™t need an X rating even then, a hard R would€™ve done it, Russ pushed for that. Dick Zanuck I guess got embarrassed, the Manson killings € because, aren€™t I probably the real first serial killer in films? I mean, it threw a lot of people. A different regime was in Washington, things were changing, it was the end of the sixties and the beginning of the seventies. We actually shot this in the winter of sixty-nine to the spring of seventy and released it in June of 1970. So, there was the whole climate of things, what was happening in Hollywood at the time, and it got looser later on in the seventies.- But, wasn€™t this the biggest money making film for Fox that year?J. L. That€™s what I heard, technically € but also, remember € they had €œButch Cassidy€? coming out € €œPattonp€? Fred Koenekamp Jr. who was the director of photography on Dolls shot €œPatton€? and went on to do €œThe Towering Inferno€? We had the fill forces of Fox behind us. If you really look at that film technically it€™s a very beautiful film. You know, Russ was a cameraman himself, he was D-day plus three in Normandy as a kid.- That movie is almost a cartoon €J. L. And that€™s right, it is a cartoon, it€™s a satire, and there were a lot of people in Hollywood that were not quite getting it that were in the power structures.- If you go back and look at some of the €œart€? films made from the early sixties to the late sixties, they were so much more over the top than Dolls ever was.J.L. Yeah, but they weren€™t getting studio exhibition, they weren€™t getting the €œA€? film treatment. So, they were still hitting the art houses, you know, in the college circuit more € and €œRocky Horror Picture Show€? came out after us, that€™s a Fox film too, and they had no faith in that for the longest time.- Almost everyone I€™ve shown that film to, saw your character and said, €œThat€™s almost the same character as Frank N. Furter from Rocky Horror!€?J.L. Yeah, you know € I guess so. I don€™t think there was any stealing € but, we did Dolls first, that€™s all I€™m saying. Yeah, I can see the Frank Furter € I love Rocky Horror Picture Show€? too. You know what, at some of these shows we€™re doing, the audience are coming in their favorite character, which of course the midnight shows for the Rocky Horror Show have been doing forever, right? So, that ought to be interesting, all these little Z-man€™s running around. €œBeyond The Valley Of The Dolls€? got it€™s first big recognition in 1990 at UCLA. And then I knew right then, we€™re home free, we€™re going to go retro with this € this film isn€™t going to go away. And they teach it in every film school there is.- It€™s never gone away.J.L. It hasn€™t, it€™s always grossed money.- Even when it made its debut on VHS in the early 1980€™s everyone who saw it loved it, nobody in their twenties knew it existed.J.L. Yeah, and I think a new generation is seeing it because there€™s still that rebellion, the youth thing. If you notice, all the so called adults, let€™s say the middle-aged to older people in it € IN IT, as characters don€™t get it, like the lawyer in it € what€™s his name, Thorne or something € the one that€™s pissing off Dolly Reed all the time € and it€™s so funny, because Russ was in his early forties when he made it.- I think it€™s the best movie he ever made.J.L. I think so too. Also, he had a full studio behind him. The only thing that happened there is that He and Zanuck got into a fight € He had a three picture deal, and the one thing that he made a mistake on € and I think as an artist € because he did €œThe Seven Minutes€? He is what I really call an auteur, He€™s good at what he does when he sticks to his own stuff, he should never do anybody else€™s stuff. But, it was the biggest budget € and major studio work, because, you know € from then he was always shooting from the hip, he was a hell of a cameraman on his own. I€™ve told this story before nut it cracks me up € I don€™t know if you know the restaurant Musso and Frank€™s in L.A. here?- Oh yes.J.L. It€™s one of the oldest € great place, it€™s revered, great place! So, I guess it was the late eighties € some friends of mine wanted to pitch a movie, it wasn€™t gonna happen, but I said, €œYeah, okay€? So, we did lunch at Musso and Frank€™s € all of a sudden out of the blue € we€™re knockin€™ back a few, we€™ve had some lamb chops € he liked to hang out there €so, the room is full because it€™s lunchtime, all of a sudden he goes to us € €œYOU WANNA KNOW HOW I LOST MY VIRGINITY?€? You know, personally it wasn€™t the first thought on my mind at that moment € well, what happened was that he and the late Jimmy Ryan, rest his soul, he just died about a month and a half ago € they were two young army cameramen, they came in D-day plus three to Normandy and they were shooting all that stuff € they ran into Ernest Hemingway, can you believe it? Because He was covering it, and Russ was an eighteen-nineteen year old virgin, and good old papa Hemingway brokered the deal, and there was a French whorehouse in the village, and that€™s how he lost his virginity. So I asked him, I said €œ Big tits, Or no?€? and he said, €œOf course kid, big tits!€? (laughs) That€™s a true story.- (Laughing) He was a character.J.L. He was a very witty man, and very funny.- His humor shines during the Z-man wild party scene.J.L. Before I flip out?- Right, the multi-colors etc.
J.L. I€™m proud of that scene, because it was very difficult to shoot and we shot it in one afternoon.- Really?J.L Yeah, I€™m proud of my colleges. Yes, the one where it€™s jungle lad and I€™m coming out in the Superwoman € and the whole thing.- Now that€™s where this film topped all the €œart films€? of the sixties, as far as going over the edge, none of them had a guy/guy scene.- No, well of course, it€™s just my luck € My first movie kiss, and I€™m kissing Blodgette, right? Well, you know € that sets your career off. It was my first film, right? Not bad being the lead in your first film, I€™m proud of that. But I was so green; I was so naïve, for the first five weeks I thought I was shooting a western. (Laughs)- How about rehearsing scenes, was that done before shooting the scenes?J.L. No, not really, we shot pretty fast.- Were your lines shot with one camera?J.L. Most of it was Panavision; some hand held with an A.R.E. Arriflex, Russ shot fast, one or two takes. Now, he may take a long time setting up on certain things, you know what I mean? And I think most of the real rehearsal was for technical. You know, if you had a complicated shot or something, like in the party scene, and they€™re pulling a dolly shot, because it was before PanaGlide, which I€™ve worked in, I love it. That hand held stuff steady state, instead of laying like, a dolly track € the camera man moves around you and sort of does a Hitchcock pan. So, usually what would slow things up, but in an honest way would be the more technical things. Not a lot of rehearsal time. And as everybody gets, he didn€™t like you to blink. You don€™t blink in it. And, in a way, it was partly how he was doing an emotional color with non blinking, but also, it€™s sort of in frame editing of pace, because that was fast. He€™d have me really speak the mock Shakespearian lines really quickly.- Well, you did em€™ perfectly.J.L. Thank you. But, you know along the lines of the pace of those screwball comedies like €œHis Girl Friday€? in the thirties, Cary Grant and Rosalind Russell, So that I really had to ride heard on with myself so that I didn€™t screw up so much.- Were there any scenes that you had to do more than one take on €?J.L. Oh sure €. Sure, I had a ball, he left me alone. I never worked with the late John Houston, but some old timers I€™ve talked to that did, he used to bug them sometimes because he wouldn€™t say anything. €œOkay, cut, print€? And finally someone went up to him and he said, €œI€™ll tell you when something goes wrong€? basically. So that was a treat for me. Russ wasn€™t getting into, €œWhat€™s my motivation? €œ €œYour paycheck asshole.€? Yes, we worked very well together. The one thing I will say is €. I stopped tripping over the cables for the first week.- (laughs)J.L. No, seriously, you know what I mean? That€™s the only thing I had to learn not to do. It took me about a week. You know those thick black cables? And I was really pacing a lot to keep the energy up and the whole thing, so every one in a while for about five days you€™d hear this crash, and the assistant director would know where I was. They€™d come, pick me up, dust me off and put me in front of the cameras. (Laughs) It€™s true. It was just great, I mean I just loved the crew, they€™d been there forever, learned so much, really did learn, you know, I was a kid after all.- You guys knocked that one out quick; most movies today take about a year to make, right?J.L. Yeah, we did that in three months. But then again remember that outside of very few exteriors like at Trancas beach north of Malibu € You know, when I€™m running on the beach with the sword, and really getting serious outside running up and down those stairs € we were all on soundstages. So, a control perennial summer environment. A lot of the movies that are on location and stuff take longer. And, I guess the bigger special effects thing in it was the gun in the mouth and the head exploding. So, for a non effects movie of that day not being shot on location, three months is a valid time, more than enough time. Hell, I€™ve shot complete movies in the indies in seven days, now that€™s really shooting fast.
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